jim and joe music ?

Oct 05, 2006, 02:16 PM

Here’s the reply I got to my query:

“Jim & Joe are terrific guys, they love music and they were very excited about my catalog. I would just caution someone as I would about any independent song plugger. Unless you work with one of the TOP song pluggers - someone like S******* B******* - your songs are not going to get heard by the top decision makers in Nashville. There are a lot of song pluggers in Nashville, and they rely on drop-off pitches that rarely get listened to. Jim & Joe have a lot of success with indie pitches, so if that’s the route someone wants to go, then go for it! But if I were doing it, I would be asking tough questions like how many sit-down pitches they got last month, and with whom. Ask them what cuts or holds they have gotten and with whom. Ask if you can see a sample pitching report for one of their baby-writer clients. Follow up with A & R on any pitches they claim to have gotten holds or cuts on. And I am not singling out J & J, because they are quite honest and hard working. I would give this advice to anyone for any independent song plugger except someone like S******* or his ilk. And S******* does not take on clients without track records.

“That is the reality of it - the only way an unestablished writer can get anywhere is through a publisher working their catalog. The only writers who get cuts through song pluggers are writers who already have a track record. And that’s the cold hard truth.

“Hope that helps! If he decides to use them, he should just make sure and tell them which songs he wants pitched and to whom; it is helpful for them to have guidelines.”

Oct 05, 2006, 03:40 PM

I agree, song pluggers are not the way to go for unestablished songwriters.  And, I am beginning to have my doubts about publishers.  You have to ask the same questions of a publisher.  How many cuts have you had recently, with whom, etc.  If you are dealing with a publisher that gets eight or ten cuts a year, mostly with indie labels, then go figure your odds.  Most publishers have catalogues with several hundred songs in them.  And, I strongly suspect they do the same thing, drop off a pitch with no inside contact and they have about the same kind of luck I would have if I sent it to them direct myself.  Probably most of them never get listened to.  I have seven songs signed by four different publishers, ranging from three months to going on three years and still batting zero.  I fully expect all of them to revert back to me after the reversion clause runs out.  So, what is a struggling songwriter to do?  Absolutely nothing, because I really think we are all deluding ourselves here into thinking something is going to happen when in truth, we ain’t got a chance.  It is a game that most of us aren’t equipped to play.  Probably the best chance you will ever have of getting your songs heard is putting them on Soundclick and MySpace. 

Oct 05, 2006, 04:51 PM

Roy, I think you got good album cuts, the idea I’m thinking is, traditional is out maybe, I hope not, but who is your publishers? Send me an e-mail: .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address)

Oct 05, 2006, 05:50 PM

lol Steve.  You are right about traditional being out.  That is why I don’t have a chance because that is what I write with a few Country Christian thrown in.  I can’t write something just because it is what is selling.  I have to write what I feel and that is what comes out.  I’ll drop you an email later on tonight. 

Oct 25, 2006, 04:43 PM

In response to if Jim & Joe are on the up & up. The answer is NO!

A previous post read like an ad for them. It stated “Jim & Joe have a lot of success with indie pitches.” These guys are bottom feeders. They have no successful track record. They are pros in the operation of smoke & mirrors.

They sell the DREAM for $150.00. The nightmare comes later and costs a lot more money!

Do not trust your songs to these SHARKS!!!  If you should doubt my post, ask around Nashville. They’ve made a living on Out-Of-Town folks, by selling the DREAM. They do not have a good reputation here in Nashville!

Oct 31, 2006, 03:10 AM

Hey Phil, the post you quoted was mine, though the words were my friend’s which in turn were quoted by me.  When you say my post “read like an ad for them,” maybe you’d like to be clear about what you’re implying.

Rather than wait for your response, I’ll go ahead and set that straight: I have no experience with Jim and Joe, I’ve never met them and I have no business dealings or financial arrangement with them whatsoever, not now nor have I ever.

I had heard their name through the friend I quoted, who at one time had been a client of theirs.  Because this person had spoken favorably of them in the past I initially made the statement, “I believe they are 100% legit.”  That was the sum and extent any personal opinion on my part.

The rest is quoted absolutely verbatim, but even though the words are not my own I know this person well enough to vouch that there’s no way I was being pitched.  That is the person’s genuine opinion, which is not to say that they can’t be mistaken, but there’s no way that they were attempting to manipulate me nor anyone else.  I asked for an honest opinion as a friend and got exactly that.  I don’t think the following reads like someone trying to pitch blind faith in the services of a con artist:

“I would be asking tough questions like how many sit-down pitches they got last month, and with whom. Ask them what cuts or holds they have gotten and with whom. Ask if you can see a sample pitching report for one of their baby-writer clients. Follow up with A & R on any pitches they claim to have gotten holds or cuts on.”

You’re entitled to your opinion of Jim and Joe, and I can’t deny that you may be right and my friend might be wrong.  It’s not impossible that my friend was taken for a ride.  But don’t go implying that I’m posting “ads” for someone who (in your opinion) is a flake and phoney when in fact you have no fricking idea.

Oct 31, 2006, 07:18 PM

Hey Michael,

I certainly wasn’t trying to ruffle your feathers. My only reason for replying to the ORIGINAL question, was to protect fellow Songwriters!

Know that, I was not implying anything negative about you in my comments. It appears that you took MY opinion to be a stab at you. I read that you quoted your friend…I still stand by my comment that, “it looks like an ad for them!”

If you choose to believe that I was intent on making you feel victimized…You Sir, “have no fricking idea.”

Nov 01, 2006, 04:37 AM

>> If you choose to believe that I was intent on making you feel victimized…

Huh?  I’m not sure what that means, it’s so vague.  Is it an apology, a refusal to apologize, a way of saying no apology is needed, a way of standing your ground…??  It’s such a labyrinth of deflections of responsibility that I’m not sure how to respond to it.

Anyway, you’ve made it clear that your intentions were merely to warn others and that you did not mean to imply that I or my friend are shills for Jim and Joe.  I sincerely apologize for misunderstanding you, losing my temper and using offensive language.

Also, if it’s true that they have no legitimate track record, thank you for bringing it to our attention.  I have to admit that my friend’s choice of words contained some contradictions, like saying they “have a lot of success with indie pitches” while implying that they don’t seem to be having much success at all.

Nov 01, 2006, 12:17 PM

Easy now guys. Let’s keep things civil. If you really want to know something about these guys, concat the better business bureau and see what they have to say.

Thanks,
Mod 8

Nov 01, 2006, 04:21 PM

I used them to plug a tune. They didn’t send me any feedback so I called and cancelled and walked away. Their main plugger, Chris Mendoza,  left and went to work as a keyboard player for one of the muzic mafia acts. They are nice people, but they are bottom feeders and mostly are into demos and production work.  I would advise anyone looking to get a cut to buy some lotto tickets and go with a publisher. Songpluggers are obsolete in this new era of corporate music. Indie music, indie records and indie groups are the only shot us commoners have to crack it. Good luck

Nov 06, 2006, 05:26 AM

Hi There,

This company also have a Car business titled Jim and Joe,
I do believe this is a scam. They offered the same deal to two people on J.P.F. and the demo’s submitted were awfull , as were the songs.
Believe me Reputable Company’s do not act this way.
Just put in Jim and Joe on your search engine and the two company’s will come up.

Garol Stoner